The Arena Ooc should be a default room

[TheMadHatter]

I know this might sound silly for those outside of the Arena/AOD, but there has been some issues within the group.

Let me explain...

The Arena_OOC_Discussion is a usermade room to end the ooc in the arena. While successful, there has been some issues on who exactly should moderator the room itself. Which has led to some fighting amongst the group. Really the only solution is to have a default room with no moderators at all. The mods aren't really necessary in reality, because a global moderator can just step in if there is any issues concerning the AUP.

So I'm asking the staff, would you guys please make an OOC-Arena? Everyone please let me know what you think. Thank you.

[Pitch]

It wont happen. Hell, it doesnt NEED  to happen. The fact that this stuff is going on is the reason the entire site hates the arena regulars, and that sucks.

Three things come to mind:

No matter what? Whoever is a moderator, someone is going to cry about it.

A lack of mods means more global involvement in the proposed arena ooc room. Someone is going to cry about the global moderator involved.

People keep whining about how favoritism, etc. All day long, bitch, bitch, moan. They forget one thing...they didnt like Fam's room because of some wishy washy "Her friends were modded" crap. And some "We're the mods and we do what we want to enforce the rules." Have they forgotten how much crying of the same tune is done in ALL rooms in ALL of TK for GLOBAL MODERATORS?

Apparently.

I stand by my point. Splitting the arena rooms is stupid. Its middle school dodgeball crap. Fam's room got the job done of removing OOC from the arena and the only reason the room was cried about was because people either weren't mods themselves or didnt like Familiar.

Moral of the story: No matter what a moderator does whether user-created, single room, global or even SysOp...somebody's gonna cry into their pillow about it.

MY PROPOSED SOLUTION. Get rid of both rooms if its really that damned serious and keep OOC to the not one, but two rooms already set aside for it. Let the arena be strictly IC.

...Which is supposed to be the set up anyway, amirite?

EDIT: By rooms set aside I mean Mainhall and OOC lobby.

[Kade]

As a benefactor of the injustices committed in the Arena_OOC_Discussion room, my opinion is void.

Thanks Pitch. /inflammatory

A Default Arena OOC room is kind of silly. There are problems in other rooms, among other cliques, but they don't get a "special room" to iron shit out.

If it did happen though? Cool. I'd use it.

I've opened the Arena_OOC room as a substitute to the Arena_OOC_Discussion room. I suspect both rooms will run for a long time due to grudges held by both sides, but at least the arguing will be broken up. As the "opener" of the room, I'm a mod, but I personally promise not to ban/kick anyone [with a possible exception if some kind of hacker comes along]. I'm never going to throw the, "it's a private room, I can do what I want" schtick in anyone's face. I think I'm carrying out the spirit of what Familiar intended to do with her Arena_OOC_Discussion room, but I also feel she didn't have the mettle to pull the trigger on her own friends (most of the other mods in that room) when they began to ruin her vision. Which isn't bad. There's a place for kind souls in life, just maybe not in... executive places.

Also, really Pitch, you don't listen to anyone. You just tell everyone who dislikes the way things are going that they're "butthurt" and remind them that it's not "their" room. So... yeah, I don't know how you intend to solve anything with that attitude, especially when the "dislikers" are such a large demographic of the Arena_OOC_Discussion room. It's like trying to put out a fire with kerosene.

This is going to be my only post on this thread. My position is known. There you go, Hatter.

[TheMadHatter]

There would be hardly any reason a global moderator would have to be bothered by it though. The reason people got mad about the global mod stepping in, in the arena, was because they were enforcing the ooc to stop. Really if the room is just ooc, the only thing people can do wrong is break the rules of the entire chat site. Which a global moderator would have to be involved anyways.

I'd just like to see the room back together and all of us on the same page. I figured no one being moderator could be that solution. The only way we can do that is to have a default room.

[Xachariah]

I agree with Pitcheh. There's already two rooms for OOC chatter; as tK is supposed to be an RP site, it might make more sense to either continue making the Arena OOC or simply go to one of those.

... although, uh, do try to blend in if you go to one of the default OOC rooms, yeah? There's enough retarded interclique drama.

[-=Styles=-]

Really the only solution is to have a default room with no moderators at all. The mods aren't really necessary in reality, because a global moderator can just step in if there is any issues concerning the AUP.

I wouldn't go so far as to say it's the only solution, but the latter harvests a very good point.

On one hand, while the room was successful, it was because it did what it was supposed to do, and that was terminate the OoC in the arena. On the other hand, the obvious side effect was a lessened population (which I presume escaped the grasp of some people's comprehension) in the Arena altogether. Therein, people began to complain about the arena 'dying'. As promoted, several times, lead by example on the matter of both subjects.

OoC room was created to deterr OoC from the IC Arena -- Lead

RPin the Arena has died? Not neccesarily. It's always been a low population room as far as actual RP goes. The same people who RPed in there continued to RP in there, it only seemed like there was a spike because people weren't turned off by the OoC so quickly. naturally there was an influx of RP to help persuede people to the OoC room.

By having that Usermade room stay a usermade room, it keeps the effort to keep the OoC out of the Arena a conscious one. People have to put themselves there in order to not OoC in the IC room. Just like with any room.

The main issue was this....

Some of the mods that were promoted displayed very obvious contradictions in the mission of creating that OoC room. The room should be a service to the Arena-goers, and not particularly a place that's subject to the whim of those who consider that "It's a private room I'll do what i want" mod mentality. That's where the problem lies, and unfrotunately for those guilty of such, they were too narrow minded to accept that they were not only wrong, but also completely unjustified in their position as a mod.

One mod, not 15 (/exaggerate), should have the privileges of being that mod int eh room, and solely due to the fact that it's just because they opened the room. It's a usermade room, yeah, I get it, but the entire purpose of opening it up was defeated when you began kicking people from an OOC room for OOC reasons. Completely....ruined, by one person in particular, whom will remain nameless.

I do have more I can say, but I'll let others speak their mind as well and elborate further as it calls for it.

[Pitch]

As a benefactor of the injustices committed in the Arena_OOC_Discussion room, my opinion is void.

This is where I make things personal. You're a bad man Pitch, a real bad man! You so bad, you smell like poop!

Yes, because being a moderator in a user made room is one of my most ardent desires in life. Herp derp.
Anyway, aside from getting into the usual nonsensical row with Kade that accomplishes nothing, I will stand by my shit.

I don't think the room is necessary. I think people need to understand that TK is not the United States Of America. And our one attempt to do right by an IC room is ending in a bunch of political he said/she said crap.

I think we all need to man up and keep the OOC to the rooms provided for us. Simple, really.

EDIT:  Also, lol...Injustices.

[-=Styles=-]

Actually you know what....I'm not posting anymore on this thread, because I know where I stand and I'm not doing this dance again.

[Pitch]

Actually you know what....I'm not posting anymore on this thread, because I know where I stand and I'm not doing this dance again.

I dont even blame you, Jester.

EDIT: I think I'm gonna take a page from Jester though. Done here. Suddenly uninspired to go through a whole bunch of waaah waaah waah. If I want to hear that, I can turn on the college rock station.

[TheMadHatter]

I was only trying to help, not cause more issues. I tried.

[Pitch]

I was only trying to help, not cause more issues. I tried.

Not your fault Hatter.

[1337]

I was only trying to help, not cause more issues. I tried.

It wasn't a bad suggestion. I think it should actually be taken into consideration to be made a default room because while yes; no other room has gotten it's own OOC room added to the site, you also have to take into consideration that no other room has NEEDED it as badly as the Arena.

And while some people might not be particularly FOND of the arena clique (myself included) I feel like leaving it as a user made room might cause more problems than not. I don't see why everyone is so against the idea.

Hatter saw a problem. Hatter suggested a solution. S'a pretty good idea.

[Familiar]

Well, I don't think there needs to be a third OOC room. If there was, in likelihood it wouldn't be dubbed the 'Arena_OOC' - it might get a fancy name so as to attract some of the other chatters. Then again, there are two OOC rooms - the only problem is the cliques going about, and how a large number of people in those rooms can make it difficult for people to keep up with one another - but hey, that's where messengers and whispers come in.

The room got made to take out OOC, because others were complaining the day after Petra got banned about the state of the Arena. On a whim, I made the room, sent out the invites, and it started then. Pai took care of initiating RP in the Arena right afterwards, so that Vivi could funnel all the other people into the room. That's why he deserved to be a mod, for helping to establish and fix a problem about an IC room.

Three weeks down the line, and the momentum began to give on the Arena seeing RP action. There's a few reasons to that:

- When RP first started it was before Christmas holidays began, but people had the free time to sit down and write out thoughtful, calculating posts.

- Christmas started, people got caught up eating food, getting gifts, traveling, and RP was at the back of their minds.

- There was a slight cough from RP between Christmas and New Years, but more people had real life going on than committing to the site.

- Nowadays the holiday is over, people are returning to work/school, and it's back to setting a schedule.


At least, that's the reasons I can think of. I haven't been much for RP, but I made an effort to at one point with Auvic and promised to continue that session sometime soon. I've got other things going on, but as so many others have said about addressing a dead IC room is, 'Lead by example so there is RP happening.'

But back to the topic at hand; the biggest reason the room got made was to end the OOC, hopefully attract people not already in the normal Arena crowd to RP in the room, and promote a kind of healthy environment when it came to people talking to one another. In the beginning I was able to address and end some escalating fights between people, gave my reasons, and only had one instance of banning someone from the room. Other than Pai, two other people were appointed by me to be mods, the others were added by the ones I made, or I felt out of respect kept the powers for reopening the room. I honestly didn't expect to keep it going.

Unfortunately, what a bunch of us had agreed upon in the beginning of making the Arena was lost in a lapse of maturity a few nights ago, and I did what I could to address the problem in the end and keep it from happening again. If people don't believe me, and they have their reasons, then I don't blame them. I actually encouraged people who had a problem to literally go make their own room.

I'm not going to start a war between rooms, or divide people. I'll do what I can to keep the AOD open for a few days, but if enough people choose the other over it, then I'll accept my own failure and use it as an experience for this next month as a global Mod.

[Inquisitor]

Aaaah, splinter groups.

As the Destroyer of Fluffy Stuff, I can tell it's only a matter of time before this little OOC movement loses all momentum. :smug:

[-=Styles=-]

I was only trying to help, not cause more issues. I tried.

You're not at fault for anything, Hatter. You've been one of the few that's kept their head on throughout. I wanted to warn you but didn't get the chance. Opening another thread like this was only going to further allow people to vent themselves and their inability to separate personal discrepensies from the cause which was originally intended.

Some people really, really didn't/don't seem to grasp just how openly they're displaying contradiction; all I'm seeing is a bunch of excuses and terrible means to justify their inadequacy.

To make this very simple, and to match Hatter on at least one point....usermade or default OOC; the room doesn't need a moderator. If things happen and the AUP is broken....report it to the current staff.

The Arena_OoC_Discussion did not need five or six moderators. It did not even need one, period. The room governed itself just fine without the moderators, just like the Arena didn't need a Moderator (surprise surprise) in the end.

"But what about when someone gets out of hand?"

If it's against the AUP, Report it to Moondog or SSS, or Mikail, or whoever's on at the time.

I can tell it's only a matter of time before this little OOC movement loses all momentum. :smug:

It died when the moderators chose to abuse the privileges of being moderators, when in fact they shouldn't have been moderators to begin with. It would have prevented this from the outset if the right things had been done.

There's already two rooms for OOC chatter; as tK is supposed to be an RP site, it might make more sense to either continue making the Arena OOC or simply go to one of those.

... although, uh, do try to blend in if you go to one of the default OOC rooms, yeah? There's enough retarded interclique drama.

/end-thread

[Moondog]

No it should not.

[Silent.Kamikaze]

This is possibly the dumbest thing I have ever seen. If you have problems with the annoyingly long named Arena OOC discussion room and its asshole mods (and I can't blame you there.) Make your own Arena OOC room. I'm sure the cool people would go to yours. :B

[TheMadHatter]

The Arena_OoC_Discussion did not need five or six moderators. It did not even need one, period. The room governed itself just fine without the moderators, just like the Arena didn't need a Moderator (surprise surprise) in the end.

It's not a bad idea just to have one person moderate the room. Since really there is still no reason for more than one or any. I have seen a lot of reasons for not making a default room, but have yet to see an explanation for having multiple people moderators.

[MadMusician]

It seems just fine without mod intervention. Everyone has been keeping their E-peen in their pants from what I observed.

But there is already two OOC rooms. There does not need to be an official third.

[Soja]

Why do you guys need an official OOC room?

Again, as a not-a-regular-of-the-arena-for-some-six-years-now, I have no stake in the outcome of this. But I must say that the fact that the Arena has split into OOC and IC rooms, and now proposing a third OOC room because of petty differences between cliques in the OOC, is pathetic.

The fact that you people cannot reconcile your differences civilly is pathetic.

Never in my most pedantic stages did I ever feel the urge to resort to this kind of splinter and re-splinter. Then again, it was also a different chat then.

Fact is, we talked, listened, and vice-versa.

Then again, this isn't just an Arena problem anymore. How many OOC rooms just for people and their cliques exist now? The number ebbs now and again, but it seems to be at a steady FOUR not counting the OOC-Lobby or Arena_OOC_Discussion. Basically, you guys need to grow up. If you can't exist harmoniously, don't respond to one another. Likewise, don't resort to the high school bitch tactic of chatting shit behind each others' backs. That'll only compel someone to respond and the cycle of disharmony will continue.

I can't tell you guys that you can't keep opening your own little rooms for your own little cliques, but I can tell you how lame it is. Most people get above this kind of crap in high school.

[TheSheng]

My honest opinion on this subject is simply TITTAYS!!! If you dont agree you're a heretic that will die a peasants death in a meth house explosion. More need not be said about this subject.

P.S. I win no matter what anyone else says

[Flamme Noire]

Again, as a not-a-regular-of-the-arena-for-some-six-years-now, I have no stake in the outcome of this. But I must say that the fact that the Arena has split into OOC and IC rooms, and now proposing a third OOC room because of petty differences between cliques in the OOC, is pathetic.

As an arena regular, I see where you're coming from (although, from what I understand, there are presently two, warring OOC rooms in addition to the default Arena.  The proposed new default room [god forbid] would constitute the fourth.).

At any rate....................

The reasoning (being the apparent squabble that erupted a few nights ago) behind the drive for a new default room is pathetic, I would agree; not necessarily the idea of a new default room itself. 

Also:  User-made rooms are fine.  Go to whichever one allows you to sleep at night.

 /digress

[Web Janitor]

I wanted to let you know I support usermade OOC rooms. People want to use this place to chat, that is fine by me.

[Pitch]

Why do you guys need an official OOC room?

Again, as a not-a-regular-of-the-arena-for-some-six-years-now, I have no stake in the outcome of this. But I must say that the fact that the Arena has split into OOC and IC rooms, and now proposing a third OOC room because of petty differences between cliques in the OOC, is pathetic.

The fact that you people cannot reconcile your differences civilly is pathetic.

Never in my most pedantic stages did I ever feel the urge to resort to this kind of splinter and re-splinter. Then again, it was also a different chat then.

Fact is, we talked, listened, and vice-versa.

Then again, this isn't just an Arena problem anymore. How many OOC rooms just for people and their cliques exist now? The number ebbs now and again, but it seems to be at a steady FOUR not counting the OOC-Lobby or Arena_OOC_Discussion. Basically, you guys need to grow up. If you can't exist harmoniously, don't respond to one another. Likewise, don't resort to the high school bitch tactic of chatting shit behind each others' backs. That'll only compel someone to respond and the cycle of disharmony will continue.

I can't tell you guys that you can't keep opening your own little rooms for your own little cliques, but I can tell you how lame it is. Most people get above this kind of crap in high school.

I know I said I was done, but someone pointed out this post to me and I just wanted to clap.

Seriously, Soja...I wish you could hear me through the screen. I'm giving you pies as often as possible because half of the bitching in the arena these days are a bunch of the newer regulars always going on and on about clique, clique, clique and accusing the so-called "veterans" of this (All day long SERIOUSLY)...and then separating themselves. Thus, forcefully making the clique crap a reality. Self fulfilling prophecy. Now its Red versus Blue. And it makes me want to smack an infant.

But thank you. Please say things like this more often.

EDIT: Just to clarify, there really isnt any "warring" between the rooms. They split after making it a point that those of us in the original room were suckin' Satan's pecker, went back to OOCing in the arena, and then made their own room under the guise of an anarchic set up  (because ALL mods are evil or something, I really dont know) or....some shit. I really don't know. Bottom line, nobody in the original room seems to care while I can't speak for the splinter group. Haven't been in there.

IBS and I still suggest a deathmatch field day, though. The 3 legged race wont just be by rope, but invasive surgery.

[TheMadHatter]

I think we came up with a solution amongst each other in the room. We can end this thread.