Banning, personal conduct and negritude

[POLICHROMA]

So hi there, guys.

Recently, I was banned for saying the word, "nigs". While I understand that the word "nigger" is specifically not a-OK (And even that has been shady, some mods enforce it and others don't), this is the first time I've understood that "nigs" (a term of endearment and mostly popularized, made-up gibberish between my close friend Ashley and I) is a bannable offense.

Unfortunately, I've never been warned about the usage of that particular word. "Nigger", yes, but "nigs", no. I can see some argument in extending the problem to all forms of the word, but most people don't know this, and there's no way to know that unless someone, you know, tells you. Also, when I originally mentioned the status of the word "nigger" and what to do about it, it was open-ended. I wanted to create discussion about where the line is, and context means a lot.

There is a HUGE difference in the usage of the word as an insult and the re appropriation of word by a particular ethnic group. "Nigs" is not offensive to me and never has been; it's a term of endearment. Perhaps I'm a little slow in understanding or knowing that its usage is a bannable offense. (I fully admit that sometimes things take me awhile)

Anyhow, I feel that the mod in question did not conduct herself in a manner that was beneficial to the community. There was no argument when the word was said, there were no insults, it was sort of a, "See you nigs later, have a happy new year " sort of event. How does banning someone for using the word in that context help anyone? How does upholding a rule that's gray at best to such a strict degree improve the user experience within the Keep?

Personally, I feel that the matter is biased as said mod has a pretty big...well, "grudge" gives me too much credit, but has a problem with me. But problems should be set aside when enforcing rules, because the enforcement of the rules goes beyond the people you may or may like. How you exercise discipline and enforce a rule has lasting complications and sets precedents for other users. Those precedents and consequences can be good or bad, so in this case, where was the good?

How does this action further help the community?
Will other users be banned for using derivatives of the words "negro" or "nigger"?
When does context come into play?
Can members of another ethnic group honestly decide the context in which it was being used?
Should people of another ethnic group be able to use these re appropriated words/terms of endearment in a positive context?

This situation both raises a lot of questions, and also leads me to think that the decision was both biased and unnecessarily heavy handed.

From my perspective, it seemed to me that a mod who dislikes a user(myself) sought to exercise power in a way that did not remedy the situation, but caused a greater problem when in fact, no actual problem existed. I don't think that's helpful to the tK community as a whole, because one has to understand why these rules were created in the first place. People shouldn't have to be called "niggers" as a negative or in an insulting context, nor should they feel as if they can't use certain ethnic based terms towards those they want to symbolically bring into a group or use as a point of affection. There's got to be a line; a difference, and context speaks volumes.

As for the mod in question---I personally don't mind someone going to town on me (heh heh) or a slugfest against me. I'm willing to entertain all manner of insults, and I'm adult enough to handle being banned for being disliked. It's okay, just please be honest if that's the case. I can handle it, and it feels better to be honest if that's a source of stress relief for the other party.

However, please don't use tK and tK's rules for personal spats. If this isn't personal, then please consider the enforcement of this rule. It doesn't make sense, and if you honestly want to clean up the language in tK, it goes a long way to warn or communicate with the individual so that they know what's happening. People aren't always as terrible as you think, but they can't deal with a situation or avoid breaking rules if they don't even know what they've done.

Also, it's very beneficial to be able to understand and interpret rules and understand the context in which something is being said before enforcing. Rules exist for a reason, and if you aren't upholding them to avoid the problems that enforcing them hopes to avoid in the first place, then you aren't really doing your job. Community first, personal issues later.


- pink

[Atheism]

> See thread concerning a ban that is not posted here.
> Feel compelled to read.
> Thread complains about use of possibly racially-sensitive word being used as a reason to be banned.
> Word used is implied "inside joke" between banned person and another user.
> Very definition used excludes others from understanding full context of the word's usage.
> States word is not racist or meant to be understood in a racist context.
> "Banning, personal conduct and negritude"
> "personal conduct and negritude"
> negritude
> MFW:

> You must be new here.
> Oh hai, pink.


Also, for you, Draco:

[POLICHROMA]

I've never known "nigs" to be racially sensitive, or offensive, which was part of the point.
Ashley is not a Keep user, has never used to keep---that was just an offhanded example of how it's always used positively with me, even in real life. And really just a thrown in aside because I really, really like my friends.

And yeah, negritude was a joke. I often put jokes in things to lighten the mood; hope you enjoyed it.

And again, I wanted to open the subject to discussion. I honestly expect to get permabanned from tK one day simply for being disliked by the staff, but I don't want to start as flamewar where people start jousting from my honor, I just want to shed light on the matter because I don't think that it's a helpful situation and should require some thought before it becomes a thing.

@Draco
Through personal experience, she's anything but fair, even headed or easy to talk to, but who are you calling a nigger? lmfao

even if fairness is the case, this was just poor moderation. Banning people after they leave with no explanation isn't usually good moderation. It's just confusing and usually people have to jockey just to figure out what's going on.

[POLICHROMA]

Yeah, let's please stick to talking about word usage. Since it seems to be really loose with the mods, maybe users talking can help shed some light on what this rule is, and how it's actually supposed to be enforced.

[Familiar]

You do give yourself too much credit.

I'm her friend, and she banned me for saying nigger.

She's a fair mod who doesn't let shit like "friend and foe" get in the way of her judgement.


That being said, I figure I'll get permabanned soon enough, because I'm not going to stop calling the Nigger, "The Nigger". I disagree with the whole thing, and am not about to change being me.

It actually wasn't me this time, but thanks for the kind words. I think.

It's part of the AUP and subject to enforcement. Very little censoring is done on the chat but I'd prefer, as does several staff members, that the chat not be associated with racial slurs. Same as sexual soliciting. We're just not that kind of place, yo.

[Draco]

It actually wasn't me this time, but thanks for the kind words. I think.

It's part of the AUP and subject to enforcement. Very little censoring is done on the chat but I'd prefer, as does several staff members, that the chat not be associated with racial slurs. Same as sexual soliciting. We're just not that kind of place, yo.

There's another female mod? I thought Ezra died or something.

Well then... all my talk of fairness is moot. I know nothing about this other person.

Also... fuck your thanks for kind words, I merely speak the truth.

Also, for you, Draco:

^
This thread just got at least 600 times more interesting...

This thread is now about Dragons.

[POLICHROMA]

Nah, dude. Familiar's a good friend of mine. Few people welcomed/were nice to me in tK when I first came, and she's ALWAYS been there---solidly. Fam is NOT the person in question and Fam's a good mod; she would have handled this differently.

And you're right, Draco. Danny rules, I need only the very, very slightest bit of provocation to shower her with compliments. <3

I mean, seriously. I have several people to thank in tK for supporting me artistically. There are several times I wanted to quit, but people like Familiar and H have always been so kind and supportive to me that they've kindled the fire I've needed to endure. I'm very grateful.

[POLICHROMA]

I wouldn't mind opening the floor to discussing that---that's part of the problem. What IS a racial slur, which ones are slurs---which are worthy of taking action over?

It's just a little confusing to me, because as an ethnic minority, my opinion and perspective on the matter is totally different. Some words at some times are bad, others are quite the opposite. I don't mean to have this sound the wrong way, but the way members who are not of that ethnic group see a word may be completely different from someone the word is meant to define.

It's a simple difference in perspective, which is natural and not a bad thing in and of itself. It's just going to require discussion and understanding to get a fair view of what's going on, and how it should be handled.

[Styles]

Quoting stuff aside...

I was banned specifically because I said the word Nigger. It has been enforced and I was continuously warned thereafter for saying it. The language clause in the AUP is pointless, imo. If the best you can do is irritate other people by banning one person for saying something no one else took offense too, in or out of context when not directly utilized to affront a specific race, then more power to you.

Sorry...but there's no banhammer in the real world. Mods need to understand that censoring ourselves to things we say everyday is not at, or even on, our priority list.


EDIT: It was a one day ban, and I received probably 20+ warning the week prior to it; on top of such there were multiple occasions I was warned not to use profanity so freely, including 'racial slurs'. It's mod discretion and interpretation, not what the AUP actually dictates. This includes the revised one which holds the same amount, if not more loopholes, and only made things a tad less vague than before.

[H]

I love you. <3

Would saying "naga" be a racial slur? As in: "Naga, plz!" Which I am fond of saying. Am I in danger. :O

[Levistus]

This thread is now about Dragons.

[POLICHROMA]

Hey, guys. If you want to do that pic stuff, that's fine, but can you please keep it out of this thread?

I'd like to start discussion that we can all politely have; loading a bunch of image macros and things is the easiest way to ensure that we won't be listened to.



And interesting point, Styles. No one was offended, so what was the point of your ban? In my case, I never got a warning about the particular word which is why it's nice to talk about it and find out exactly where the line is.

[Styles]

Honestly? I think the point of the ban was to make an example out of me.

It didn't work, mind you, lol. But seriously, it was just that word that got me into trouble. Not the plethora of other words that we're not supposed to say in conjunction with the word Nigger.

Yeah, I understand that some people are sensitive to it, and being politically correct is the right thing to do; my issue lay with the fact that most of us are adult enough to be able to look past what is obviously not being considered a racial slur, and it was still punished. As long as an active hate campaign against any race isn't being put into effect, I don't see a problem with using American slang.

[Levistus]

The mods have always been anal about saying nigger and nigga and NEGRITUDE and we all know it; we just don't give a shit. What we're seeing now is a black person getting mad because they can't say their word, either. We can't all be Javi and get away with saying nigger all day.

Also,

[POLICHROMA]

Requesting a cleanup because the pictures are getting out of hand.


Oh yeah, I don't know, I've been gone for awhile and will disappear again in a week. D:

No one's mad. Please be respectful about the tone of the thread. I mean, if you want to shit on things, I can make a toilet thread specifically for that.

[Inquisitor]

This chatroom is not old enough for liberal use of the word "nig", "nigz", "nigga", "niggardly", or "nigger". Too many whitebread apologists afraid that their one black friend will stop hanging out with them if they say nigger or something.

[POLICHROMA]

I don't want to comment much on the maturity of users here. In reality, those people have to deal with that on their own time---tK is just one place of many where such people coagulate.

But so much for it being a day ban. [I'm still banned, btw.]

This is a bit of an aside, but for every day that I'm banned I'm going to release at least one page of my new comic, Lipstick
So you guys had better keep this kind of activity up because I'm using every opportunity I can get for personal good. (And perhaps shameless promotion.)

[Draco]

That wasn't a comic, that was a picture. I am disappointed.

Also... this thread is still about Dragons.

[Pitch]

ITT: EDGYEDGYEDGYEDGYEDGYEDGYEDGY. Not necessarily including anything said by Atheism or OP but *damn* I can feel you guys and your cool even through the internet. It's burning my face.

[MadMusician]

I could of sworn we had this discussion a long, long while ago.

[CaptainRobin]

Nobody's forcing you to come here, nobody's making you pay to come here. If you get banned, it's very likely your fault, so I'd suggest just dealing with it. I'm quite sure you can live for a day or a week or a month without TK-- if it's that much of a problem, then you should probably address the mod(s) in question, not the community. The community doesn't often have anything particularly constructive to say, so instead of trying to call out the mod publicly, I'd find a way-- either through forum PM or other mods-- to get in touch with the mod and discuss it with them. Humility is probably a plus.

Also-- real life doesn't have a banhammer, but the internet does not have potential for physical harm. I can assure you randomly shouting the N-bomb in society will not garner a much more favourable reaction than being banned online. That's really a strawman argument, though, as I don't think the standards of real life should ever be applied to the internet.

In conclusion, using the 'we're adult' excuse on the internet is pretty fallacious, especially in this scenario since I've never heard a non-racist adult drop any racial slurs out of some very specific context (perhaps a story or a joke they've forewarned is racy). The definitions of adult vary and are by no means beholden to your standards (or mine!), so trying to pin them on anyone is kind of silly. Better to just leave that argument and pick a better one.