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Author Topic: Thread #2 Ft. Chris Hansen  (Read 19723 times)

CherryBerry

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Re: Thread #2 Ft. Chris Hansen
« Reply #15 on: August 11, 2015, 08:01:25 PM »

This isn't about her. Or you. I'm just in here waiting for proof, Jackalope. If you want to shitpost, go in the other thread.
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Crest

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Re: Thread #2 Ft. Chris Hansen
« Reply #16 on: August 11, 2015, 08:50:11 PM »

And... silence.

Gotta love how people go quiet when they have no proof of anything.

Make sure to repost the points on why their excuse doesn't work in any vaguely civilized justice system, between both me and Kade.

Though I'm sure that's going to be blamed on some conspiracy about me and Kade being friends, even though I had a fallout with one of my own friends from telling her I wasn't going to hang out with someone who was being his cumdumpster.  But details and accuracy are irrelevant around here.

All issues aside, I was wondering how long it would take before Minerva decided it was necessary for her to be the center of attention again. Lel.

No, this is just the tactic you fools have been using all along.  That's so far the only comment I've made about myself.  Go take your shitposts elsewhere. Like the lounge.
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Kade

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Re: Thread #2 Ft. Chris Hansen
« Reply #17 on: August 12, 2015, 06:11:46 AM »

reddit, imgur, tumblr, etc. these are also sites where enormous community-spanning clusterfucks and implosions are insanely common.

it is true that on most websites you don't get to face your accuser or see any evidence against you.

but you do get to know why you were booted, or why your thread was shut down, etc. "harrassment" "verbal abuse" "racism" "pornography" whatever.

but the reason why you don't get to know or face your accuser is an issue of economies of scale. with websites that see THAT MUCH traffic, it's impossible to let you know who every single person that reported you was. it could be hundreds of people. its impossible to let you cross examine. or to show you all the proof they sent in their reports.

but these sites also have a far greater infrastructure to verify claims made in reports. the ability to investigate problems on these sites is way greater. they don't have to rely on hearsay, although they do rely on crowdreporting to know where to look. so for systemic reasons, the average user is far more certain that a boot or shutdown is 'legit' on these other sites when compared to TK.

its also worth mentioning that these sites do not act on small issues. the mods don't bat an eye at a few reports. they only get involved when the reports from the community reach some statistically significant tipping point.

these websites also don't give a single fuck if you register a new account or use a proxy to get back in. they assume that having to rebuild your spot in the community, losing whatever stars and points you built up on your old name, or whatever was punishment enough.

also, let's face it, the staff on massively successful websites is usually more active/attentive, more experienced, more professional, and in a lot of cases better paid (lol) than tk's staff.

tl;dr
comparing tk justice to how justice is administered on other "successful" websites is fucking asinine.
« Last Edit: August 12, 2015, 06:17:46 AM by Kade »
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Rom Spaceknight

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Re: Thread #2 Ft. Chris Hansen
« Reply #18 on: August 12, 2015, 11:30:15 AM »

reddit, imgur, tumblr, etc. these are also sites where enormous community-spanning clusterfucks and implosions are insanely common.

it is true that on most websites you don't get to face your accuser or see any evidence against you.

but you do get to know why you were booted, or why your thread was shut down, etc. "harrassment" "verbal abuse" "racism" "pornography" whatever.

but the reason why you don't get to know or face your accuser is an issue of economies of scale. with websites that see THAT MUCH traffic, it's impossible to let you know who every single person that reported you was. it could be hundreds of people. its impossible to let you cross examine. or to show you all the proof they sent in their reports.

but these sites also have a far greater infrastructure to verify claims made in reports. the ability to investigate problems on these sites is way greater. they don't have to rely on hearsay, although they do rely on crowdreporting to know where to look. so for systemic reasons, the average user is far more certain that a boot or shutdown is 'legit' on these other sites when compared to TK.

its also worth mentioning that these sites do not act on small issues. the mods don't bat an eye at a few reports. they only get involved when the reports from the community reach some statistically significant tipping point.

these websites also don't give a single fuck if you register a new account or use a proxy to get back in. they assume that having to rebuild your spot in the community, losing whatever stars and points you built up on your old name, or whatever was punishment enough.

also, let's face it, the staff on massively successful websites is usually more active/attentive, more experienced, more professional, and in a lot of cases better paid (lol) than tk's staff.

tl;dr
comparing tk justice to how justice is administered on other "successful" websites is fucking asinine.

Not to mention being able to "face your accuser" is an invitation for said accuser to be harassed and makes it less likely that people will speak up in the first place.
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CherryBerry

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Re: Thread #2 Ft. Chris Hansen
« Reply #19 on: August 12, 2015, 11:57:12 AM »

It's like Crest said.

"Oh no I'm being harassed on Skype!"

-blocks harassing user-

"Oh. Well golly gee willickers, that was easier than I thunk."
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MEGAMADMUSICIAN

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Re: Thread #2 Ft. Chris Hansen
« Reply #20 on: August 12, 2015, 12:31:13 PM »

That can actually be taken in many different ways. In that case Rom, you're implying the rights of the accuser are greater than the rights of the accused.

Harassment is bad, mmkay? I'm fairly sure most sane folks know this. Trick is, making false claims about someone is also harassment: Something that people have done, and continue to do in many systems. There is a reason why there's a process in most legal systems that do in fact try to weed out who's bullshitting and who's not: If you can just say someone is a spy and get them arrested for it, those places tend to also have reputations for having shit legal systems.

But just what is harassment? Off the top of my head, I state it as someone bothering the everlasting piss out of you, and they won't stop when you ask them to, especially if it's unwarranted. That's harassment. In this way, if you are a public figure, you must be ready to deal with some level of harassment: People are going to want to talk to you. People are going to want to insult you. People are going to want to say some of the most vile, despicable things to you. Whenever you are posting on a forum such as this, or say something on chat, or tweet something, or post something on facebook, you are acknowledging that what you just said is not out in the world, and that other people may comment about it. You are a public figure at this point. If you went to a shopping mall and started shouting racial slurs, do you expect people to come 'talk' to you? Is it harassment if they do? You're screaming offensive things in public: People are going to at least comment about it. That's not harassment: It's in a public space, and as such, it's as much of their space as it is yours.

One of the big issues sneaking up on us on the time though, is the fact that people are starting to develop a -very loose- interpretation on what harassment is, to the point that it's literally becoming a free speech issue. You talked to me about me needing to move my car? HARASSMENT! You talked to me because I punched your baby? HARASSMENT! You looked at me because I stripped naked on the subway train? HARASSMENT! If I went on facebook or twitter and said things like "Obama is a muslim communist" and "That black thug in Ferg deserved to get shot" and other inflammatory things, I fully expect to get the shit 'harassed' out of me. Not only would I deserve it, but it's because I posted it in a public place as well. Outlawing people's ability to say inflammatory things, people's ability to gossip as people WILL do (We are social creatures after all!) and say anything negative about anything will do no favors for anyone. Quite the opposite, really. Besides, I like it when shitbirds say fucked up things. They're telling me I shouldn't be anywhere near them.

That being said, an online environment is a bit more different. In this way, this is the purpose of mods: They essentially become the prosecutor, and in many cases, your accuser as well. One of the forums I go to and frequent (But don't post on) is RPG net. I do not agree with a good amount of mod decisions: but at least they -do- inform people of just why they're dong it. Still, it is very rarely a single thing that they do to get banned.

http://forum.rpg.net/showthread.php?698051-Infraction-for-Zak-S-17%29-Permanent-Ban

Another, RPOL, is much more sane. You basically have to be a shitbird or horrific at following basic instruction to get banned from there. They got a good amount of rules, but they're very clear in their intent: Don't be a piece of shit. They also don't tend to ban on a first time offense, though this is not the issue.

http://rpol.net/game.cgi?gi=10929&date=1439127005

Yes, these are private sites. They can ban you for not liking MLP. It's well within their legal rights to do so.

That being said, it becomes another issue entirely when things that do actually break laws, or come close to it, become involved. They drop that shit faster than a cooking hand grenade. Getting the authorities up on your site minding your business is not anything that anyone wants. And they tend to take things involving kids very seriously. It's quite simply, bad Juju for everyone involved, so the best thing to do is to get that crap as far away from the site as possible.
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Crest

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Re: Thread #2 Ft. Chris Hansen
« Reply #21 on: August 12, 2015, 05:52:43 PM »

That can actually be taken in many different ways. In that case Rom, you're implying the rights of the accuser are greater than the rights of the accused.

Harassment is bad, mmkay? I'm fairly sure most sane folks know this. Trick is, making false claims about someone is also harassment: Something that people have done, and continue to do in many systems. There is a reason why there's a process in most legal systems that do in fact try to weed out who's bullshitting and who's not: If you can just say someone is a spy and get them arrested for it, those places tend to also have reputations for having shit legal systems.

But just what is harassment? Off the top of my head, I state it as someone bothering the everlasting piss out of you, and they won't stop when you ask them to, especially if it's unwarranted. That's harassment. In this way, if you are a public figure, you must be ready to deal with some level of harassment: People are going to want to talk to you. People are going to want to insult you. People are going to want to say some of the most vile, despicable things to you. Whenever you are posting on a forum such as this, or say something on chat, or tweet something, or post something on facebook, you are acknowledging that what you just said is not out in the world, and that other people may comment about it. You are a public figure at this point. If you went to a shopping mall and started shouting racial slurs, do you expect people to come 'talk' to you? Is it harassment if they do? You're screaming offensive things in public: People are going to at least comment about it. That's not harassment: It's in a public space, and as such, it's as much of their space as it is yours.

One of the big issues sneaking up on us on the time though, is the fact that people are starting to develop a -very loose- interpretation on what harassment is, to the point that it's literally becoming a free speech issue. You talked to me about me needing to move my car? HARASSMENT! You talked to me because I punched your baby? HARASSMENT! You looked at me because I stripped naked on the subway train? HARASSMENT! If I went on facebook or twitter and said things like "Obama is a muslim communist" and "That black thug in Ferg deserved to get shot" and other inflammatory things, I fully expect to get the shit 'harassed' out of me. Not only would I deserve it, but it's because I posted it in a public place as well. Outlawing people's ability to say inflammatory things, people's ability to gossip as people WILL do (We are social creatures after all!) and say anything negative about anything will do no favors for anyone. Quite the opposite, really. Besides, I like it when shitbirds say fucked up things. They're telling me I shouldn't be anywhere near them.

That being said, an online environment is a bit more different. In this way, this is the purpose of mods: They essentially become the prosecutor, and in many cases, your accuser as well. One of the forums I go to and frequent (But don't post on) is RPG net. I do not agree with a good amount of mod decisions: but at least they -do- inform people of just why they're dong it. Still, it is very rarely a single thing that they do to get banned.

http://forum.rpg.net/showthread.php?698051-Infraction-for-Zak-S-17%29-Permanent-Ban

Another, RPOL, is much more sane. You basically have to be a shitbird or horrific at following basic instruction to get banned from there. They got a good amount of rules, but they're very clear in their intent: Don't be a piece of shit. They also don't tend to ban on a first time offense, though this is not the issue.

http://rpol.net/game.cgi?gi=10929&date=1439127005

Yes, these are private sites. They can ban you for not liking MLP. It's well within their legal rights to do so.

That being said, it becomes another issue entirely when things that do actually break laws, or come close to it, become involved. They drop that shit faster than a cooking hand grenade. Getting the authorities up on your site minding your business is not anything that anyone wants. And they tend to take things involving kids very seriously. It's quite simply, bad Juju for everyone involved, so the best thing to do is to get that crap as far away from the site as possible.


Yeah, this harassment thing goes way too far with people.  Zeke gets talked about on an applicable thread and left alone in chat, he claims he feels harassed.  Meanwhile, for the last twenty four hours there have been people in TK not only shit talking me constantly in chat, but trying to drag my real life into it (while inherently having every aspect of it wrong, but trying). Apparently they think anyone that disagrees with them is me at this point, and that warrants dragging my name into the mud.  "I Smack Women" shittalked Ave about being demoted - apparently that was me.  Ave comes out saying I've been "attacking" him for two weeks.  That's funny, because I made one passive comment two weeks ago and his name didn't come out of my mouth since while he ranted and raved and bitched about me those two weeks and claimed he ran my chat - while the users themselves were asking me to demote him to protect them.  Other people I've never even MET are word-of-mouthing shit about CPS (which is categorically untrue), my ex being abusive (which is true but they have the info on it wrong), the fight I got in with my roommate (anyone who was on skype video with me knows that everything they're spewing is wrong), and literally anything else they can to try to bitch about the fact that... I'm dead set on getting Zeke's disreputable ass off this site.

This is legitimately what they're reducing to.  I'm sure I COULD pass it as a hate campaign, but I'm honestly not sitting here bitching "HARASSMENT"; and I sure as hell ain't one of those people like Zeke that just goes around mercilessly harassing everyone.  The idea that he's calling harassment that has stayed strictly in this thread until a few people watching this debate get absolutely sick of their shit and comment is beyond warped.

Just face the music that you wrote for yourself, dude.
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Averus

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Re: Thread #2 Ft. Chris Hansen
« Reply #22 on: August 12, 2015, 08:56:02 PM »

Quote
Ave comes out saying I've been "attacking" him for two weeks.

You have been. Anybody and everybody who will listen to you. I'm a sociopath, a pathological liar, I eat babies.

Quote
That's funny, because I made one passive comment two weeks ago and his name didn't come out of my mouth since while he ranted and raved and bitched about me those two weeks and claimed he ran my chat - while the users themselves were asking me to demote him to protect them.

That's why I keep getting messages from people telling me you're saying all kinds of evil shit and spreading rumors for no reason, right? I've mostly laughed that off, but unlike you, when I have something to say about someone, I say it openly. If your users needed protection from me, why didn't I just /ban * Cherish and all her friends when they came to Szu? Or all those times over the last several months that Chef pissed me or Sary off? I even had Sary straight up ask me to do it and I told her no, because I'm better than that. But you act like I'm supposed to be upset about not being an admin in your dinky little chat and when I don't take you seriously, suddenly I'm an evil bastard and the poor innocent users need protection from me, despite the fact I purposely withheld from doing anything to them.

Yea, OK. Sure.

Quote
I'm dead set on getting Zeke's disreputable ass off this site.

Thanks for making that clear. You're not relevant, you're not important, you don't have a cause, so you're making one up. You've been pulling the ALL THE STAFF ARE CORRUPTORZ shit since CC, when it used to be true. I don't particularly like the tK staff, I don't really talk to them, and I have issues with Familiar in particular, mostly that I don't trust her. But I don't act like the keep is the center of the universe and try to pretend that a private website is the pinnacle of democracy and needs to be defended with blood, sweat and tears, either.

It's a roleplay chat room.

It's not a big deal.

It's not important.

You're not important.

Cherish isn't important.

Fuck, even Zeke isn't important.

You have your own chat room, with blackjack and hookers. if TK is such a huge problem for you, do something with it. The only thing you've done with that universe is your failure of a book on Amazon. The reviews for that are fucking hilarious, by the way.

Peace out, have fun with your meaningless internet crusade. You've gone off the deep end just like you told me you were afraid you would when you were a teenager. I feel sorry for you.
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Riker

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Re: Thread #2 Ft. Chris Hansen
« Reply #23 on: August 12, 2015, 09:05:06 PM »

Redirect to put us back onto CherryBerry's topic, instead of the storm of everything else, there are other topics open for that.
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Crest

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Re: Thread #2 Ft. Chris Hansen
« Reply #24 on: August 12, 2015, 09:09:28 PM »

So... you're entirely wrong, but okay.

The only time I responded to you and called you a sociopath was when you came at me over one.  Passive.  Comment.  I haven't said shit about it.  YOU continue to bring this up.  If other people are saying shit that's on /them/.  You, on the other hand, are obsessed with fighting a ghost that isn't there, isn't even haunting you and is somewhere chilling in the afterlife bahamas.

No, I'm not important.  But I can make a point.

No, Cherry isn't important, all I said is Cherry deserves to see the logs and the system is broken.

No, Zeke isn't important, and he should be gone.

This is irrelevent arguing.

Oh, those reviews, you mean the ones written by buttburned TKers that are so proud of it that they went around rooms spamming it for shits? The bad reviews that only come from the unverified purchases, as opposed to the good ones from verified purchases?

Seriously.  You say I need to get lives, but that's sad as hell.

Whether or not you think you were seen as a threat in the chat, you were, and so you were removed.  Period.

This really has nothing to do with anything.  You're just distracting at this point.
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Riker

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Re: Thread #2 Ft. Chris Hansen
« Reply #25 on: August 12, 2015, 09:12:13 PM »

Redirect to put us back onto CherryBerry's topic, instead of the storm of everything else, there are other topics open for that.

I've been trying to keep the thread on track - but people continue derailing it. I'm waiting for that proof you don't have, Familiar.

Please. This. (Sorry for the repost, but this SHOULD be the subject of this topic.)
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CherryBerry

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Re: Thread #2 Ft. Chris Hansen
« Reply #26 on: August 12, 2015, 09:12:59 PM »

You should be saying that to Ave, not Crest. But you're right, in the end.
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MEGAMADMUSICIAN

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Re: Thread #2 Ft. Chris Hansen
« Reply #27 on: August 12, 2015, 09:13:49 PM »

Obviously, in my sleep, I've stumbled into some sort of alternate bizarro universe where pedophilia is ok.
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Vivi

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Re: Thread #2 Ft. Chris Hansen
« Reply #28 on: August 13, 2015, 03:59:47 AM »

At this point we've reached a consensus that the evidence we have available to us shows you are Nazu and have been previously banned.

No, we will not be showing you this evidence as that will simply encourage yourself, and other ban-evaders we end up catching in the same manner, how to avoid detection from some of the more effective methods we use to verify identities.

As far as the staff are concerned this thread is done. If it gets out of hand it will be locked.
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Kade

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Re: Thread #2 Ft. Chris Hansen
« Reply #29 on: August 13, 2015, 05:22:14 AM »

At this point we've reached a consensus that the evidence we have available to us shows you are Nazu and have been previously banned.

No, we will not be showing you this evidence as that will simply encourage yourself, and other ban-evaders we end up catching in the same manner, how to avoid detection from some of the more effective methods we use to verify identities.

As far as the staff are concerned this thread is done. If it gets out of hand it will be locked.

zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz
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